Note: This is the full Q&A with Allison Davis O’Keefe, a freelance photojournalist from New York. A graduate of Claremont McKenna College and the International Center of Photography, O’Keefe, a relative of Dave Hakstol’s through marriage, spent several years with CBS News before jumping into her own projects, beginning with this one. Her book, One Goal, is available at the Sioux Shop (online at http://www.siouxshop.com) and signed copies are available through O’Keefe herself. Her website is www.allisondavisokeefe.com. I wrote a feature on the book for USCHO which you can find here.
Quotes are after the jump to save space.
TB: How did you come up with the idea?
ADO: I’d always wanted to do a long-term, kind of documentary project. And I think a team kind of provides somewhat of that. It’s a close community within the team itself, but also the community that’s such a fan. I didn’t grow up in this kind of atmosphere, so these fans and this experience was not familiar to me. I was sort of fascinated and blown away that everywhere we went, there are Sioux fans. On almost every flight going in and out of New York, I see it. And I would see somebody on the street in Manhattan with a logo on their jacket. It goes everywhere. So, I kind of was like, ‘What is that about?’ And so that was kind of how I set out. And it was the last year — this was to be the last year of the Fighting Sioux [1], which, I think is part of the reason why Dave let me do it. He was super reluctant for many years, and I think that this is why he allowed it.
TB: So this is an idea you’ve had for a while?
ADO: I wanted to do a full project on my own. For anything, access is everything. Any journalist knows that access is. I think I had an ‘in’ into this team – but that doesn’t mean that I just walked into the locker room and started taking pictures. It took time. I had to build trust with Dave and with the team. But I had an in into something that I think others probably didn’t, so I used that to my advantage and that’s how I came about with this project if that makes sense.
TB: That season was so cataclysmic… for a number of reasons. Not only was it the nickname, going into the season it was maybe one of the most promising teams maybe this decade. How did talent and maybe the focus of that team play into the project?
ADO: The expectation game was there all the time. We talked about it, and Dave talks about it, and I write about it – it’s serious. They meant business, and they were out for it from the very beginning, and they really wanted it no matter what. They still had a lot of fun along the way. But I think it was so expected. It was almost like … I mean, even going into the Frozen Four, I felt like it was just like they were going to win. Which I think made that moment and that loss so much — so much — more devastating. But yeah, the whole season, it was like, that was it. I think that’s why something like this, for me, evolved over time. Because in the beginning, maybe, they would say, ‘In the end, you’ll have this project, we’ll win, and there will be a book to be a memento to this whole event.’ But it became about what you can learn along the way, and what you can learn from losing. I would argue that coach Hakstol himself learned a lot from this season.
TB: So in the context of the book, were you hoping they would win, or were you kinda just letting it play out and see? Because what it kind of ended up being was not so much about the winning part.
ADO: Yes, that’s exactly right. In the beginning — I was coming off of many years at CBS News, especially covering politics — I was like, I’m a journalist. I’m neutral, I’m as neutral as can be. But that’s … come on. But I will say that in that last moment I felt it so much more than I expected — so much more. And I did feel connected to these guys. I thought that they expected to win and that was going to be the end goal and that was going to be the result. But I was ready to play along with it.
TB: Probably the most striking thing to me…the thing about Hakstol is that it seems to the media that he doesn’t look beyond the rink a lot. And there’s a quote in here [2] that struck as something that you don’t hear from Hakstol very often. I guess you probably knew him personally for a while, but just looking at his demeanor, was that something that kind of struck you as interesting that, as much as he understood, thought and cared about hockey he understood the big picture?
ADO: This is what I think people don’t know about coach Hakstol. And I didn’t know him that well until this project. We sat down for a number of interviews that talked extensively, and I learned that more in this project. But I think what people don’t know about coach Hakstol is that the reason that he’s so passionate about this team, and this town, and this community itself is that it’s not just players. For him, it’s about raising – well, raising is not the right word, they’re already adults — but it’s about shaping them into being better human beings. And the larger context of that quote is, he says that some of these players are going to go on to play in the NHL and some of them won’t. But they are all going to go on to be human beings. Everybody knows the story about Matt Frattin. Nobody knows the story of Brent Davidson. He just didn’t get to play. He’s sitting in the stands [3]. He was just told he wasn’t going to get to play. The picture’s not in here, but there’s a picture before this of he and Dave talking on the ice, and Dave’s like serious and he’s not happy with him, and he was pleading and pitching his case. He didn’t get to play and ended up sitting in the stands. And towards the end of the season he was playing all the time, and then he got the hat [4]. It was a big deal in the locker room, who was going to get the hat next. I think Brent – I don’t know, because I don’t know him personally – but I think he’ll be a better person for everything that he learned, and everything he took — and that all comes back to coach Hakstol. He’s not just coaching a team, he genuinely is a mentor, a disciplinarian, a father figure, a leader, and a coach. Yeah, when he’s talking to the media, he’s talking about who scored, who’s in the lineup, who’s out, who’s injured – whatever. It’s a lot more than that.
TB: Would you say that some of this book is about Hakstol? Even more than just the team?
ADO: Definitely. He’s the leader of the team and I wanted him to be a character throughout. Look, a book evolves over time, and if I could I would have more text, more of the interviews in there. I don’t want those to go lost, because we spent a lot of time, and he said a lot of things that I think he hasn’t said publicly before. And he knows they’re all recorded. I would love for that to come out, if somebody would be interested to know him better. Those are little more insight into him as a leader. I think that’s what I talked about a little bit, or at least tried to talk about, is that they’re always taking cues from him, but he’s still in that process too. I don’t know what year it is, seven, eight, nine years that he’s been coaching, and he’s still learning. About a year after this we were talking, and he said, “I really wish I had let them relish their wins, and how it important it is that you recognize your accomplishments.” But this season, they wouldn’t. They wouldn’t touch the trophies. And the season after this…
…there’s a reason that he did that, because of what happened the year before. But I think Dave knows that there’s importance in that. You need to be proud of what you accomplish.
TB: Throughout, you kind of pepper in more than just the team itself, but the experience. The context North Dakota landscape, four or five reminders of how bad the weather in Grand Forks is…
ADO: It’s a sense of place. Where you are…you’re meant to feel cold. I’m cold, you’re cold… It’s freezing right now.
The kids getting ready for the game, some of the fans are super intense. You can see how many people are here. They have cheerleaders. To me, that feels super intense and that’s how I want it to feel.
TB: Was it a lot different than what your idea was for it originally, or as the season evolved?
ADO: Absolutely. This is coming out two years after they played, so it’s reflective, it’s sort of commemorative, but I think that’s why a number of these are introspective. As an overall project, it evolved. It became black and white. That was sort of an aesthetic, editorial choice. The way it’s laid out — it’s not in order of how the season went, it’s a little bit more symbolic. There’s a lot of that. I didn’t have any full expectations. I just wanted to go through it with them. I just wanted to experience what they experience. I wanted to give a sense from the inside and figure out why everyone loves this team so much. And honestly, I don’t really think I have the answers. But I hope I show a little bit of it. It’s a unique experience. I do believe – I hope people here buy the book, sure, because this is the audience that knows who these people are. But I hope this goes beyond it as well. For anyone that likes hockey or understands the sport. I have a couple of friends who’ve never [been to a hockey game]. But some of these pictures still mean something to them. And I think there’s something to that in terms of the feeling and passion of a sport and how it brings everybody together.
Part of it too was in the timing. Yeah, that picture of Frattin in the locker room is devastating, but I wanted it to be a positive thing. But I wouldn’t have wanted something like this six months after that game. And Dave wouldn’t have spoken the way he speaks about it now. He’s come a long way since then.
TB: Talk about Chay a little bit…
ADO: I don’t know that much about what a hockey player is made of, but this guy worked so hard. I mean, he fought so hard all the time. He just wanted to play, he just wanted to be here. At the end of this quote [5], he just said “It just gets you every time.” Every time he can’t believe he’s here. But I mean, how cool is that? He’s just so appreciative of everything.
TB: Just like Hakstol, do you think the team went as Chay went?
Totally. Dave talks about it – you have to do things the right way. It’s about winning, and winning the right way. But that’s the thing, right? It’s about life lessons and learning how to do the right things for all of us.
Footnotes:
[1] It was the last full season for the Fighting Sioux nickname, after all of that work. Last season, of course, the team played without the nickname at regionals and also operated as “North Dakota” for almost the entire month of January, even though jerseys with the nickname on them were still being used. Of course. Now, however, the nickname is seen exactly nowhere on the ice, even though 12,000 fans still call them that every night.
[2] The quote from Hakstol is on page 75: “It’s not just about hockey. We all certainly know that. There’s a bigger picture here for every individual and everybody that’s part of it. It’s called growing up.”
[3] Referencing a picture from p. 80.
[4] p. 86
[5] p. 56: “Number one on my bucket list was to be able to play in this rink. And still to this day, I get goosebumps just coming out of the tunnel. It’s everything I imagined and more.” -Chay Genoway
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